Parallel world. Work with Roma in Transcarpathia
Kateryna Paierska has been working in Roma camps for 12 years. Being a part of Caritas of St. Martin (Caritas-Spes Transcarpathia), she visits 7 Roma settlements, where she organizes work with children. In Katya's car, we visit camp after camp, where children gather at social centers or kindergartens to get a few liters of milk with a loaf of bread or a hot lunch.
Children are also taught literacy at these centers. A settlement with a Roma woman being already a teacher is a great blessing. Usually such women are illiterate, but still know a little more than children. We met Morika in one of these camps in Transcarpathia. At one time, Morika got married at the age of 12, and her daughter at the age of 14, and now at the age of 34 Morika is already a grandmother twice. Her 16-year-old daughter is now expecting her third child. Morika's husband died of tuberculosis, so now she raises 8 children and helps to raise her grandchildren. Morika's life is typical for Roma culture. We talk with Kateryna Paierska about the peculiarities of the Roma community and service there.
— I worked in a church library when I came to Ukraine, and I was still thinking of what I should do. One mother from Mukachevo Roma camp came to us, she was expecting another child and considering an abortion. I talked to her, tried to convince her that abortion is not good. Then our paths diverged and I did not see her for a while. It was in autumn. Before the New Year, I was at a retreat, and a priest told us to think in silence about what was special for us this year, perhaps there was something we could have done but we didn't. And while I was praying that woman came to my mind. I had her address and thought to find her, but there was always a lack of time. During prayer, I decided to find this woman. I came to the camp on Orthodox Christmas and met her - I was very sorry, because she did have an abortion. Then, when I started working with them, she gave birth to two more children: a boy and a girl.
— How long did it take for them to accept you as their own? And what contributed to this?
— It took a year or two of constant work. It was very important for them that I am with them and not avoid them, that I eat with them, cook for them, etc. We worked together in the garden, learned how to plant vegies, care for, harvest and preserve. They learned everything: growing potatoes, onions, tomatoes. And it was really touching when they saved their first grown tomatoes for me... Yes, they didn't eat the first fruits themselves, but presented them to me.
— Ms. Kateryna, the Roma have a completely different culture and customs. How can you evaluate how good they are as parents?
— Of course, this is a different culture and mentality as well. But what kind of parents they are depends on each specific family. In general, I can say that they love children very much, especially men. When children are small, they enjoy playing with them. But there are those who have problems with alcohol, and this, of course, is a huge problem. I have now started Family Day in Roma camps. I organize a holiday for families so that men and women learn to spend time together in an interesting way. They were not used to this. Most often, I go to Pavshyno (a village in Mukachevo district of Transcarpathian region of Ukraine, where the Roma camp is located. — Author). They already know when we organize family holidays and come to my assistance. With a group of men, we make a fire and cook bograch together. When we first prepared such a celebration, they did not know what it was like to play: parents with children, or husbands with wives. Now they already know and are looking forward to it.
— Roma camps are very reserved. What conditions must be met for them to accept you? What cultural characteristics should be followed?
— To become "the one of theirs", you have to love them. If you come and say "I will help you" - they will accept your help, but not you as the one of theirs. They need to feel that they are loved. I love Don Bosco very much and belong to a certain Christian spiritual community. He also taught that it is not enough to say "I love you" to young people, they must feel it. However, this love should be strict. I have to tell them the truth, not just pat them on their heads.
Another feature of Roma is a completely different sense of time. Usually a person is in a hurry, but they are not. For example, the Liturgy is to start at five o'clock. They don't understand what it's like to come on time. I learned to come earlier so that they see my car arrive, and only then they are getting ready. Sometimes they say, 'you visit those people, please visit us'. I thought they wanted to talk about something, so I came, but no - they needed me just to be nearby. They just need attention. Roma, as a camp, is a reserved community, but it is one big family composed out of many families. No one asks if they can pay a visit, they just come. When a woman is preparing food and someone comes to the house, she shares food and treats everyone equally.
— You say that the Roma take their time. And the fact that girls get pregnant at the age of 12-13 - isn't it a rush to live?
—Yes, but the Roma are also slowly realizing that such early marriages are not good. It's all about tradition, it is accepted that when a girl turns 14, she is already a woman, ready to have her own family. I was just talking to a woman in the camp who is going to marry her daughter at Christmas. I tell her that her daughter is still very young, and the woman tells me that she has already celebrated her 14th birthday. It's all about mentality. For example, Liuba in Kholmek (a village in Uzhhorod district of Transcarpathian region of Ukraine, where the Roma camp is located. — Author), who is a Roma herself and now prepares charity lunches in our center for Roma children. She married her granddaughter at the age of 12, and six months later the girl was terribly depressed because she could not get pregnant. Infertility is the greatest fear for them.
— Was it a cultural pressure exerted on the child?
— I haven't met any Roma girl who would get married with the idea that we will wait and live, and then there will be a child. For them, children are the meaning of life. They take care of their siblings from an early age, carry them in their arms, entertain them, therefore, it is normal for them to want to have their own child. It's in their culture. It is also interesting that none of the girls who managed to finish high school or university wanted to get married or have more than 1or 2 children.
My big goal is that the girls could wait at least until they are 16. But in Roma culture, when a girl turns 18 and is unmarried, no one wants to marry her anymore, because she is considered "old". She then has to marry someone whose woman died during childbirth, for example.
— If a girl is 12-13 years old when she gets married, how old is a husband?
— Up to 18 years old. Boys also get married very young. They have a wedding according to the gypsy rite. Because no one will marry such young people in the church or in the registry office. I have a big dream - to open the door to sacramental marriage for them.
— They are so young. Do they understand that marriage is a lot of work both on relationships and on providing for the family and children?
— Most adult Roma living in camps are illiterate. That is why the Transcarpathian Regional Charitable Fund "Caritas of St. Martin" (Caritas-Spes Zakarpattia) is building kindergartens and classrooms to educate children. We teach them everything, to hold a pen, to write, to read at least in syllables, so that they can then enter school. I heard that there are Roma from Uzhhorod and Mukachevo who graduated from universities, but I am not personally acquainted with them.
Our success is that our two girls from the camp in Konsov and one from Pavshyno entered the Hungarian lyceum; it is a great joy for us. I also know two guys who studied in Hungary: one to become a welder, the other - a confectioner. But now, because of the quarantine, they are sitting in a camp, and distance education is out of question for them, unfortunately.
— The Roma have already settled in these camps. To what extent can you assess whether their life is changing for the better?
— Yes, they have already started building. Here, for example, a new roof, here — the windows have been changed (showing). But all the same, there is no water in their buildings. Girls are often neglected, because Roma houses are one-room huts with no separate room where you can wash, and the girl will not wash in front of her brothers, and the water must be brought into the house, heated... Although women seem to wash something every day, kids will be kids - they go outside and are dirty in no time.
— What about sexual education in Roma families?
— Children and parents live in one room. The sex life of parents often takes place in front of their children's eyes. We ask that the children at least sleep in separate beds, not with their parents, but that's that.
— If children and their parents often sleep in the same bed, and there is a problem with alcohol in families, were there cases of sexual violence against children?
— No no. A man who touched a child would be stoned. Believe me, they would beat them to death. Children are sacred to them, and I have never heard of anyone abusing a child. As for the role of a woman in the family, everything is not so good here, because according to their tradition, a woman does not have the right to refuse sexual cohabitation with a man. She is simply obliged to be with him as soon as he wants, whether he is drunk or rude to her. According to their customs, it is a woman's duty. Therefore, no one can interfere in the sexual life of a husband and a wife. Of course, everything can be there, but not the case with children involved.
— When we entered the camp, many children were coughing. Are the children registered with doctors?
— If a child is sick, the Roma treat this seriously. They always turn to the doctors. But doctors often refuse to help them. I am a nurse by education, so I have to examine them, give injections and even take delivery. Once a woman went into labor, we called for an ambulance, and they said, "Let her die" and did not come. So I had to remember the whole theory and take delivery. I had never taken birth before, but, thank God, a healthy child was born. I just didn't exfoliate the placenta, because there were no conditions: a smoky, dirty house with neither warm nor clean water. So I took the child, wrapped him in a blanket, wrapped the mother and took them both to the hospital. We arrive in the middle of the night, a sleepy doctor comes out, and I ask why you didn't want to come. Well, in the end, I gave them the child and the mother, and they quickly took care of them, being quite scared.
— In every Roma camp, the Caritas-Spes Ukraine Mission, in addition to other work, provides children with food. Are Roma children malnourished?
— Roma don't run farms. We gave them chickens, but those chickens did not live to lay eggs. The same with pigs. Not everyone keeps a garden either, some simply don't have the space because they built houses for their children in their yards. Roma women are cooking when they have money for food. Accordingly, children eat whenever there is food, mostly once a day in the evening. Parents work at seasonal jobs, earn a penny digging potatoes or collecting scrap metal - then there is something to cook with. They have no education, so they work hard. Often they can work a day and not be paid. Sometimes a man goes to Hungary to work in construction, not only doesn't he earn anything, but he needs to be sent money to return home.
— Working with Roma, what do you dream about in your work?
— I dream of three things. Sacraments for families, education for Roma children and a step back from early marriages. Although changes have already taken place among the Roma. Now young people choose a partner for themselves, previously parents agreed on marriage. It's easier with this now. The Transcarpathian Regional Charitable Fund "Caritas of St. Martin" (Caritas-Spes Zakarpattia) operates in 7 Roma camps.
